Monday, July 31, 2006

Schook calls for framework for international mission in northern Kosovo (Zëri)

Zëri carries an extensive interview with PDSRSG Steven Schook, in which he calls for a framework for an international mission in northern Kosovo.
Following is the full translation of the interview.

The process of resolving the status of Kosovo is taking on a new drive. The situation in northern Kosovo cannot remain as it is. In this phase of the negotiations process, the situation in the northern part of Kosovo has gained a lot of importance in the table of the international community and cannot be left asides. The international community is considering the possibility of establishing an international mission that would be a body above the municipal leaders of the southern and northern part of Mitrovica and other municipalities in northern Kosovo. The mission would last 3-4 years with the aim of integrating the north of Kosovo, according to the agreement on final status. The framework that will define this issue will be worked in parallel with other negotiations on status. PDSRSG Steven Schook, who has raised this issue in meetings with the Contact Group, UNOSEK and Kosovar leaders, says that in the northern part there is a lot of political rhetoric coming from “appointed and irresponsible leaders” such as the Serb Coordination Centre for Kosovo and Milan Ivanovic. He says it is a terrible mistake that Serbs didn’t participate in the last elections to have legitimate leaders elected by the free vote that would speak and work for their interests.

In the interview for Zëri, the retired US General, who served in Kosovo for two years, tells how he “transformed” from a military officer into a diplomat and how he came back to Kosovo again.

Present at the meeting of “elephants” in Vienna, which he calls historic, he prefers the free debate from the “minds and hearts” of the leaders rather than reading speeches.

You have earlier served as general in Kosovo. How come you came back here, but now as a diplomat?
I have been in Kosovo for almost two years, and then I went to Sarajevo as commander of SFOR. And then I retired in November of 2005. I went to work in Washington DC for a private company. I was the senior vice president. And one day I got a telephone call from the State Department asking if I would consider them nominating me to the UN as the PDSRSG for UNMIK. And I think I thought about it for a split second and I said absolutely I’d be interested. And then I went through a series of interviews with the United Nations and here I am. I was here for two years. Obviously I became quite attached to the conditions and circumstances here and serving the people here. Given the opportunity to come back at this very critical junction for both the region and for Kosovo I was delighted to do that.

How do you find this transformation? You are working in Kosovo again, but now as a diplomat. Is it difficult?
Well, no, I hope not. I hope it is not too difficult. Quite frankly my last couple of jobs in the military were very close to what I am doing now: dealing with the political leaders, on political issues, trying to move things forward both in Kosovo and in Bosnia. I know there is a perception in the public of military versus being a diplomat, but very often the work that is done in the military, depending on the position you are in, are much related to diplomacy and not only strictly just guns and security. For example in Bosnia I worked in the reform of defence and moving beyond the Dayton Agreement. I met regularly meetings with the Tripartite Presidency of Bosnia, the Ministry of Defence, the Prime Minister, I went very often to Republika Srpska. And it was a huge decision when they (Serbs) agreed to give up from the Ministry of Defence and from creating an autonomous army in order to create the united army of Bosnia and Herzegovina. All these were political decisions that we were working. Therefore I don’t think that it has been a major transition.

You participated at the meeting in Vienna, the so-called elephant round and you heard the Pristina delegation. What is your impression of that meeting. You also had a speech there?
My impression was first of all it was a historical event. It was a historical event without a lot of tension in the air. It was noticeable that there was not a lot of tension in the air. It was conducted by both sides at the highest level of professionalism and diplomacy. And very responsible by both sides. My personal opinion is I thought the Kosovo Delegation is very well prepared, executed very well. And their best session was in the afternoon session. And I hesitate to say this but the reason I say that the best session was the afternoon session because they were not reading speeches, they were speaking from the head and the heart and they were speaking about things as they saw them, and the way we should go. So my message to the Team of Unity was don’t listen to the speechwriters too much, stay with your own instincts.

Ahead the meeting with the Contact Group after the “elephants’” round in Vienna, one of the issues I raised was that as final the status continues to build momentum on speed and nears the recommendation from UNOSEK, things in Kosovo that perhaps we haven’t moved as far along become more and more important – north of Ibar. That issue becomes more and more important of how it exists today versus few years ago.

As final status becomes closer, while the resolution of status is continuing, this status quo (in the north) is no longer satisfactory so I spent a lot of time with Deputy Prime Minister (Lutfi Haziri), the Contact Group and I think it is very important that we start to describe the framework whatever the result of the final status. This framework is a transitional period north of the Ibar, perhaps separate municipality mayors from north Mitrovica, south Mitrovica and then international community still sits on top of that for a short period of time, 3 to 4 years, so that this part becomes better integrated into results of final status.

So I think it is very important we start describing this in a very responsible way so that it counters the political rhetoric of some of the leaders from the north.

Do you think a special UN mission will be installed in the north?
I wouldn’t call it a special UN or EU mission but a generic international community mission. International community would sit on top of that for a period of time to transition it into the local institutions however that’s described in the final status. I’m very careful to say that way because I don’t know what the final status is going to be, it’s not my decision, I participated in it time to time. I don’t fully know how this whole thing will look like but everyone understands that north of Ibar is significantly different than the south of Ibar. It’s been different for several years, this is the reality. As we get closer to the recommendation or decision by UNOSEK, I think it is very important to address in a responsible way the future. We’ve done a lot of things up here recently. We have some high-impact projects that will be working in the both sides of Ibar. We need to fix some things that deal with infrastructure issues. We have many international police there, up to 500 international police north of Ibar. We’ve got a lot of Kosovo Serb KPS up there. We’re making some fundamental changes in two border points, Gate 1 and Gate 31. I’m paying attention to that part because I am very concerned over some very irresponsible statements made by some of the appointed leadership north of Ibar.

When you spoke about the possibility of a new mission in the north, is the Negotiations Team aware of this?
Yes. I spoke to the Deputy Prime Minister. We had a good conversation on that. Look, it is time to lay out a framework. I’m not going to go into details. But, the framework is this: there will be some international presence that will sit on top of Mitrovica, it will be there for a transitional period, definite period of time. This is an important message because whatever the final status is, there is not this huge, abrupt, immediate change with the present situation we have in the north.

When I was in a visit in the north what I said is that one of the most terrible decisions ever influenced by Belgrade was the non-participation in the elections and as a consequence there are no responsible elected political leaders that would represent all the people. This has been a terrible mistake. They not only did not take part in the current governing structures, but the biggest problem now is that it is difficult to influence changes there, because you will have to deal with appointed leaders, very irresponsible: CCK and Milan Ivanovic.

I would rather deal with elected officials, with their agendas, their wishes, who are there to serve the people in the northern part of Ibar, without personal benefits and without personal agendas.

The reason I mentioned my visit there is that the entire rhetoric and all the energy of the appointed leadership in the north has to do with things completely separate from the needs and wishes of the people living there. This is a mistake, irresponsibility, and it should be improved.

Are there Albanian KPS members in the northern part of Kosovo?
There are in the cross-border areas, but not much in the police patrolling. Police patrolling is mainly carried out by Serbian KPS officers. I discussed this also with some war veterans’ groups in Kosovo. I explained to them that for me it makes sense that one of the lessons learned in the history of policing is that the best police patrols are carried out when police officers belong to that community. For me this is not any problem.

In its statement after the meeting of the ‘elephants’ the Contact Group stated that they are concerned over the situation in the north, with increase of Serbian illegal security structures, are you too concerned with what is happening in the north?
I am not sure that something is increasing there. What I am sure about is that there is an increase in political rhetoric and that some positions are being taken. This is causing a big concern. In June there was a huge setback because of some poor politicians.

The bully tactics from some people to pull the municipality leaders and influence some of their decisions are irresponsible.

I was recently there. It was my second or third trip there. I will soon go there again when I am back from New York (UN) and US. When I was last there I made a tour and talked to the kids in the pools, old people, mother, grandmothers, sons and daughters, I talked to men working in Leposavic, Zvecan…I asked all those I met which was their main concern in the northern part beyond Ibar and the answers I got were; employment, economic development not good, problems with infrastructure, sewage, electricity…No one, not a single one told me it is security.

How is Belgrade behaving with Serbs at this time?
I think that Belgrade can do much more. I would put Belgrade in this category; in my opinion Belgrade has possibilities and responsibilities to find responsible leaders in the northern part and instruct them not to do what they are doing now and to return to the situation before June’s statements. I do not know if Belgrade stands behind these actions, but Belgrade can correct and improve these actions. Therefore, in my opinion, Belgrade is responsible for what is happening there.

Is the international presence in a position to face with the situation if these leaders call on people to go out on the street and protest, demonstrate because they are not happy with the status process? If they take action that leads towards internal division of Kosovo?
There are two kinds of answers about this. First, KFOR is still here to maintain security and stability. So if there are actions that stir the calm and safe environment it should be counted on KFOR to be part of the solution. Second, I am doing my best to encourage Belgrade to help with these appointed leaders. I have been there often and I will go often. I think that UNMIK is doing a lot for this not to happen.

Have you responded to the letter by Prime Minister asking for more competencies?
Yes, I gave the letter with UNMIK’s answers in Friday’s meeting.

What competencies are mentioned there?
I think you should ask Prime Minister Çeku. It was his request. We answered in a responsible way to these requests.

Did you answer positively?
For most of the things he asked we offered the way on how to move forward and what should be done. Most of the things in his request, with a few exceptions, are really budgetary and fiscal issues that need to be solved. As you know there is a fixed budget in the Kosovo Consolidated Budget, if we add new competencies, new requests, then we have to direct them to other sources. This will mean that there will be decisions taken at the highest level of Government as to the way to relocate the funds within the current budget. This means there should be the consent of IMF which still plays a key role in determining a responsible budget and the expenditure way. Therefore we have adopted steps to be taken to address some of their requests.

41 comments:

arianit said...

It's easy to get cooperation - just cut the money trail from Belgrade.

Wim Roffel said...

Mr. Schooks credentials become clear when he talks about his time in Bosnia where he is proud to have visited the RS a few times. If he had really accomplished something he would mentioned that instead.

It seems that he is following the old American line of viewing Mitrovica and the Serbs as the only problem. I can still remember how - I think it was in 2001 when an Albanian demonstration was expected to try to cross the Ibar - the Americans were busy doing weapon searches in North Mitrovica. Schook shows the same attitude: not a word about problems south of the Ibar.

I think it is bad news to see such an ignorant man on such an important position regarding the future of Kosovo.

mitrovica pika pika said...

Mr. Schooks credentials become clear when he talks about his time in Bosnia where he is proud to have visited the RS a few times. If he had really accomplished something he would mentioned that instead."

It seems, to serbs there is none that is impartial in international communitty, as this bitch ruffel claims. One must be aware of the psychosis involved in a group that claims that everyone is its enemy. Paranoia is not a virtue Bitch ruffel.

ivan said...

its really funny, how Schook talked to people in North Kosovo and Metohija, and all the Serbs were in fact in favour of the albanian tehft of territory. These Serbs actually do see a bright future only when the albanian theft is complete. And it os only the evil Belgrade, and evil Northern Serb leaders who are the problem.

But Schook actually has a very limited memory, since he forgot what happened in March 2004, or the fact that the attackers of the Serb boy have been recently released even though there is video evidence about this attack.

This whole policy reminds me of what is going on in Lebanon. Israelis have killed more than 200 children, and yet US claims that this is the fault of the Lebanese people.

Serbian children are killed in Kosovo and Metohija, but in fact that is the fault of Belgrade, because the poor siptars got angry.

ANYC said...

Poor serbs are running out of people to blame. It startes with the CNN,BBC, Abc and entire US,UK and EU administrations,Nato and your immidiate neighbors. Then it goes to just about every UN administrator culminating with Petersen.Weisner and Schook are also bad now. A few weeks ago you wanted Ahtasari to resign together with Rohan "for not doing their jobs" Oli Rehn recently thanked your PM for not blaiming him for losing football matches.
Is everyone against you? Or are you just a paranoid bunch? I will let the psychiatrist do their findings in that subject...it should make for a good post doctoral study of paranoid societies coming to grip with reality.

raindrop said...

Sometimes I wonder if Ivan's and Wim's problem comes down to reading comprehension issues. Clearly they didn't learn this skill in school which says a lot about their ability to analyse anything. For example, Schook did not say that the Serbs agreed to have albanians govern them. What he did say was that there are more important issues like: how come I have no job,no electricity,no water and other essential life necessities, problems that people on BOTH sides share. and that Roffel if the truth of the situation: the problems of reconstructing a society and necessities are important and neccessary for both sides and is what both groups want. Furthermore, the Serbs ARE the main problem right now because of their refusal to support an independent state or work along with it. Every other ethnic group in Kosovo supports independence now and working towards an equitable future. The childishness and immaturity of bloggers like Ivan and Roffel--who probably have never visited Mitro or Kosovo--doesn't allow them to see that people's needs are more important than serving some silly nationalist crap which just resulted in a bunch of wars which Serbia lost miserably.

And as someone who works and lives in mitro (btw the new mayor is doing an excellent job fixing up the south side, rebuilding the roma mahalla--the roma have come back in force). People on both sides do say the same things as Schook mentioned. They just want to live and live decently. The rest is just a bunch of crap for pols to deal with.

(To pika pika: chika chika! That username cracked me up!)

Serbs In Kosovo are in Danger said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Serbs In Kosovo are in Danger said...

First of all according to the UN the Serbs in Kosovo are in Serbia and their capital is Belgrade. The Serbs are not going to act like Pristina is the capital and Ceku is there leader. They will continue to look to Belgrade as long as Kosovo is a part of Serbia. Serbs will not pretend that Kosovo is an independent state. There will be no severing of ties to Belgrade.

mitrovica pika pika said...

Acording to realiy serbs find themselves in Kosova- independent Kosova. Enjoy

ivan said...

I agree to Serbs in Kosovo are in danger. Officially Kosovo and Metohija is still part of Serbia, and for the Serbian people it is natural that they will trun to Beograd and Kostunica, rather than to the person who is commanded their deaths during the Croatian Oluja and the UCK terror, Agim Ceku.

Serbian people felt on their skin what albanian terror is capable of, and even though Schook refuses to see the reality, Serbian people can not trust the government where Ceku and Taci are leading it.

what is the point for Serbs to participate in the siptar governement, when all of their requests are ignored. Just the way you ignored the Serbian parlament, that whats Serbs are doing to you. We are actually using your tactic, i guess what goes around comes around hurts.

And I love the comments anyc is posting, where its the serbs against the world. But let me just remind you that your civilized world is composed of only two states, USA and UK. USA we see what good brings to the world, the way they freed Afghanistan and Iraq, and not to mention their support to lebanese children killings. And we have UK, the colonial power, who destroyed countries like Iran, India and Pakistan. My point is that your " civilized " world, looks at only its own interest and doesent care a penny about " brave" siptars nor the " evil " serbs.

Fatos said...

IVAN SAID:
I agree to Serbs in Kosovo are in danger. Officially Kosovo and Metohija is still part of Serbia, and for the Serbian people it is natural that they will trun to Beograd and Kostunica, rather than to the person who is commanded their deaths during the Croatian Oluja and the UCK terror, Agim Ceku.


Ivan, are u saying that people in northern Mitrovica were the war criminals who massacred innocent women and children, since Ceku fought them? If that’s the case they should not only be out of Kosova but also out of Serbia - Hague is the place for them. You should praise Ceku for fighting such criminals.


IVAN SAID:

Serbian people felt on their skin what albanian terror is capable of, and even though Schook refuses to see the reality, Serbian people can not trust the government where Ceku and Taci are leading it.


As I said, they are more than free to leave. We are very appreciative of Serbia for keeping its borders so open.


IVAN SAID:

And I love the comments anyc is posting, where its the serbs against the world. But let me just remind you that your civilized world is composed of only two states, USA and UK. USA we see what good brings to the world, the way they freed Afghanistan and Iraq, and not to mention their support to lebanese children killings. And we have UK, the colonial power, who destroyed countries like Iran, India and Pakistan. My point is that your " civilized " world, looks at only its own interest and doesent care a penny about " brave" siptars nor the " evil " serbs.


So why are Artemije, Kostunica and other kissing their ass for help? Why $600 million from good Serbian people to lobby the US congress...
Yeah, I guess we like the fact that our civilized world is composed of these two countries - the rest will shush and listen.

I was hoping the recent events had put some sense into you, I guess I was wrong. If I were you I would waste my time discussing some other non-Kosova issues in some other blog because the Kosova one is decided and needs no more discussion from you. I would suggest some meditation techniques discussion board.

Fatos said...

Serbs In Kosovo are in Danger said...
First of all according to the UN the Serbs in Kosovo are in Serbia and their capital is Belgrade. The Serbs are not going to act like Pristina is the capital and Ceku is there leader. They will continue to look to Belgrade as long as Kosovo is a part of Serbia. Serbs will not pretend that Kosovo is an independent state. There will be no severing of ties to Belgrade.


OK, we will wait then for two or three more months until status adjustment happens.

raindrop said...

According to the UN the Serbs in Kosovo are currently under UN administration i.e. UNMIK. They are not currently under Serbian administration because of the war crimes that their government committed. Their refusal to cooperate with UNMIK and therefore the provisional Kosovo government means that they are abandoning their rights and opportunities to improve their lives by being part of the political, social and economic process. The Serbian government lies to them making them believe that somehow they will be "rescued". However, it is painfully obvious that this is not going to happen and the Serbian government's capriciousness in this matter only makes Serbia's position worse and the position of her people worse in Kosovo and Serbia both.

ivan said...

Fatos,
" Ivan, are u saying that people in northern Mitrovica were the war criminals who massacred innocent women and children, since Ceku fought them? If that’s the case they should not only be out of Kosova but also out of Serbia - Hague is the place for them. You should praise Ceku for fighting such criminals"

I guess according to your logic and Cekus logic serbian babies are capable of masaccaring siptar victims. Thats why Ceku is responsible for the killing so 600 non albanians, and also for giving an order during the Oluja to croatian soldiers to open fire on Serbian refugees.


" As I said, they are more than free to leave. We are very appreciative of Serbia for keeping its borders so open."

Dont forget that Kosovo was never an independent state, it was part of Serbia and Serbian cradle of culture for the past 600 years. Siptars percentage in Kosovo only started increasing after Tito opened the borders to you after the second world war.
So since you are the guest to this land, be my guest, albania is not very far. You can however always be a Serbian citizen, and you will get all the rights Serbian citizens do get.

" So why are Artemije, Kostunica and other kissing their ass for help? Why $600 million from good Serbian people to lobby the US congress...
Yeah, I guess we like the fact that our civilized world is composed of these two countries - the rest will shush and listen. "

Unfortinatelly thats how you play the game. As for ass kissign you are the masters at it. US ass is full of siptar saliva, they are not able to use toilet paper any more, but they have to was their ass with water now.

We are just using your tactics, but we cant really go that far in raising statues to Clinton in the middle of our capital.

" OK, we will wait then for two or three more months until status adjustment happens."

Nothing will change fatos. You cant get an independant state without the UN councils approval. And please dont forget that Russia has a veto, and they stated already several times that they will use it if US and UK try to impose a solution. You are stuck with us Fatos, so I suggest you buy some opanke and and replace your white hat with sajkaca, so you can seem like a better serb.

NYoutlawyer said...

What are you shiptars doing blogging here? Why aren't you helping your hezbollah nutso brothers fight the Jews? Guess it wouldn't be good PR for you right now. In time you can all join in the fight against the "Big and Little Satins".

NYoutlawyer said...

Sorry for the typo, that's Satans. albaniacs are quick to call someone stupid if you commit a typo. What a joke, most have never seen a school.

ANYC said...

OH look NYoutlawyer is here. This is his therapy session considering that he screwed up his life so miserably. And as predicted he is posting stuff that has absolutely nothing to do with anything discussed.

Ivan
It doenst matter whether SC votes yes or no. It would be nice but it means nothing. Look at Taiwan-one of the most developed countries in the world with one of the strongest armies. As long as the most powerfull recognize you thats all it matters.

Now as far as your reply to who you consider civilized world-let me bring you back up to reality -again:
Nato - is made up of most Western countries(they bombed you).
One more thing as we are talking civilized here-expelling 1 million people and killing 10,000 is hardly a thing to be labeled as civilized.
Maybe you forgot what the word means, Here is a quick definition just for you:

tr.v. civ·i·lized, civ·i·liz·ing, civ·i·liz·es:
To raise from barbarism to an enlightened stage of development; bring out of a primitive or savage state.


It doesn't say kill all your neighbours and expell them by force and then pretend it never happen-so shut your mouth about civilized world being on your side.

ivan said...

Anyc,
“tr.v. civ•i•lized, civ•i•liz•ing, civ•i•liz•es:
To raise from barbarism to an enlightened stage of development; bring out of a primitive or savage state.

It doesn't say kill all your neighbors and expel them by force and then pretend it never happen-so shut your mouth about civilized world being on your side.”
Its very funny that you are writing this. Let me remind you that 7 years ago you expelled all of the non- albanians from Kosovo and the ones that stayed still live in abnormal conditions (lack of basic human security). 7 years after you were freed by the “ civilized world” , almost none of the 200 thousand refugees came back to this “ civilized land” , and the ones that did come back they got a very nice welcome back party ( when you were capable of organizing it with bullets you did so, but stoning is your specialty). Not to mention that in those seven years under the “ civlilized worlds “ protection you managed to kill more than 3 thousand non-albanians and claim that these were non ethnic motivated crimes. You destroyed more than 100 churches and most of them were more than 200 years old, and on the grounds of those ruins you built statues to the people who actually conducted the expulsion and massacre of non albanians.
Even your civilized protectors condemned your crimes against the non albanians, and they constantly pressure you to improve the status of them. Even their troops who eventually came to protect you, now don’t feel safe from your people, and in effect they are no there to protect the non albanians. Don’t you find that ironic?
And as to your comment of killing 10 thousand albanians and expelling more than a million, out of those 10 thousand, I wonder how many have been UCK terrorists. The case of Racak where you undressed the dead bodies of the terrorists to make them look like civilians really brings doubts about that figure. And as for the displacement of the milion people, its funny how one milion left but 1.5 milion came back. Did you manage to multiply in that short period?
“ bring out of a primitive or savage state” this is funny from a person coming from a society where blood revenge is a common practice, and where courts absolutely have no power.
“To raise from barbarism to an enlightened stage of development” More than two bilion euros have been invested in Kosovo in the last 7 years, and you still are not able to have a minimal supply of electricity. And guess what, the cuts of electricity are made mainly to Serbs, but especially when the temperature falls below -10.

mitrovica pika pika said...

Serbia is run by a cartel

Author: Nenad Dimitrijevic interviewed by Dejan Ilic for Feral Tribune (Split)
Uploaded: Wednesday, 02 August, 2006

Serbian political scientist teaching in Budapest discusses denial of crime, collective responsibility and the problems confronting Serbian society today

Over the past years you have given several talks in Serbia and written a number of texts on the need for Serbian society to confront the evil of the past, i.e. its own role in the events of the 1990s. What is the cause of your engagement?

There are two questions here. The first is: What actually happened? The second is: Is what happened relevant for living in Serbia today? The answer to the first question is to me simple and unambiguous. Great iniquities were committed in the past: mass murder, persecution, deportations, destruction of property. We can identify this injustice as crimes committed against non-Serb population on the basis that it was ethnically non-Serb, and in the name of the Serb ethnic group and all its individual members. This, in my view, is the starting-point for answering the second question. There is no alternative to confronting the truth. Not to do so has dramatic consequences: the crime is not recognised as crime, the victims are not recognised as victims, the perpetrators are not recognised as perpetrators. Omission to do so does not remove the past, but rather affirms it in practice. I am speaking here not about the intentions of the actors, but of the situation in which the political, cultural and moral heritage of the crime remains permanently present.

This can be summed up with the simple proposition that one cannot put aside the past by either an act of political will or mere silence. It is clear today that policy towards the past became the point of division within the democratic forces following the change of regime in 2000. Those who were prepared publicly to defend the lie about the crime have won. What I will call colloquially ‘post-Dinđić’ Serbia appears today, six years after its liberation from Milošević’s regime and three years after Đinđić’s assassination, as a state which has decided to stay in the past.

Few, of course, would publicly declare that the period under Milošević is something that should be preserved or restored; but the analysis of the dominant values, ideological matrices and behaviour of the leading political actors reveals a practical commitment to the preservation and reproduction of essentially the same ideological themes and governing mechanisms. Our present is based on retrograde and anti-civilisational choices of approach to the past which simultaneously form in a decisive manner the character of our present and our attitude to what constitutes a desirable future. These choices are inspired by an a priori refusal on the part of citizens, nation, society and state to confront what happened not long ago in the area that used to be called Yugoslavia. The refusal commonly takes the form of denying criminal, political and moral responsibility for the crimes committed. This then materialises itself in political and social speech, political and social activity, in which the central place is taken, neatly complementing each other, by betrayal and national honour; obsession with a glorious past and celebration of equally glorious defeats ranging from Kosovo in 1389 to Kosovo in 1999; complaints that the world does not understand or respect us; hatred of minorities; glorification of murderers as heroes, and much else besides. One can say that this country has fallen victim to unbridled right-wing options, ranging from a specifically Serbian form of liberal nationalism personified by the ruling coalition to a specifically Serbian form of street fascism personified by the Serbian Radical Party.

You say that you too are responsible for the crimes committed by the Serbian side, by the very fact of being a Serb. What do you mean by that?

To say that I am co-responsible for the crimes on the basis of national membership implies that you too, and all those who are Serbs by nationality, including our children, are also responsible. I defend, in short, the concept of collective responsibility while affirming at the same time that politically I am a liberal. This may sound extravagant or simply wrong. Many people, including liberal Serbs living in Serbia and abroad, do not agree: they say that this only contributes to the mystification of the nation, or that the affirmation of the concept of collective responsibility perpetuates in the long run, despite good intentions, the worst elements of Milošević’s inheritance. I wish to stress, however, that my position is not doctrinaire - it is just an attempt to identify the main obstacle that bars Serbia’s progress to civic and political normality. It is not a question here of culpability. Culpability is a legal category applied to individuals who become identified as perpetrators or collaborators in acts defined as criminal in nature following a correctly executed procedure. The difficulty is that legal-criminal procedures are not sufficient for confronting the recent crimes. We are dealing with mass crimes, with the manner in which the regime selected the victims, the role of the political elites, the support extended to the crime and its perpetrators by a large number of ‘ordinary people’, i.e. with the wide acceptance of a perverted system of values in which approval of the crime was a sign of morally correct behaviour and patriotism, and finally with the heavy moral and political consequences that the crime has left behind. These are the factors that should condition our way of looking at the past, the choice of institutional mechanisms that should help us to confront it, and the assessment of our individual and collective political and moral positions.

All these factors could be reduced to a simple proposition: every non-Serb, i.e. every innocent person who was killed because he was not a Serb, was killed in my name, for I am a Serb. I believe that this painful perception represents the foundation of the moral responsibility of all members of the Serb nation. I will repeat something that I wrote long ago: I am accidentally a Serb, but the crime was consciously and systematically executed in my name. It follows from this that the fortuitousness of my national identity has been cancelled out by the deliberate intention and activity on the part of those who proclaimed my national name to be the reason for killing those of another name. The fortuitousness of my national being ends at this point, because the crime committed in my name is a final fact of a special kind: the ideological foundation, nature and extent of the crime are such that it penetrates my individual identity. Therefore, in order to be able to become autonomous individuals, each of us separately and all of us collectively must confront the fact of crime. This facing up to facts and their assessment is the first aspect of moral responsibility. Secondly, we must address the community of the victims, and state clearly that what was done in our name was a crime which we condemn - this is another collective act through which we would re-affirm our individuality.

You argue at the same time that the Serb national identity has been destroyed, and that it must be rebuilt anew. Is it possible that the only indisputable fact that will remain at the core of the Serb national identity is that Serbs have committed crimes while everything else will become questioned? If so, then the refusal on the part of Serb society to confront the events of the 1990s is perhaps inevitable and understandable?

The Serb national identity has been destroyed with a highly inflammable combination of nationalism, mass crime and refusal to recognise the true nature and consequences of this crime. We can discuss at length whether from the historical point of view nationalism as an ideology contains also positive elements, but in the Serb case such a discussion no longer makes sense. Serb nationalism in the recent period has manifested itself as a barbarous ideology: it abolished the difference between good and evil and sent a message to the Serbs that they are free from civilisational constraints and can kill at will. Following this self-exclusion or voluntary withdrawal from civilisation, i.e. after a collective sacrifice of all fundamental moral norms, it is illusory to speak about something worth calling national identity. I do believe that when we use the first person plural and say ‘we Serbs’, we can only refer at this moment to the recent crimes.

Confronting a crime and its consequences is a very painful and humiliating experience for all members of the Serb nation. To that extent the refusal of the majority of members of Serb society is foreseeable and at an elementary psychological level understandable. The fact remains, however, that it is impossible to justify this refusal. The thesis that it would be counterproductive to ‘open old wounds’, because it would further divide society, is wrong in an elementary sense: the fact is that society is already deeply divided, as a direct result of the war, the perception of it, and the political abuse of its consequences. Since the border between truth and lie in regard to the past is unclear, the lie can effortlessly be translated into a manipulative political discourse. One should also not forget that the lie of which I speak consists precisely in presenting the recent crime as something that can be justified in the name of defence of ‘national interest’.

In this sense the view into the past is a pledge for the future. To put it differently, dealing with the issue of moral responsibility should not be viewed as a burden, but as a process that should help us accept as our own that minimum of universal values which we rejected not long ago, and which separates civilisation from what is not civilisation.

Simply stated, two things are crucial for the transition in which Serbian society finds itself today: democratic processes and market economy. It is possible, however, to show that at this moment both the democratic procedure and the market are working in favour of maintenance of the system of values that was built during the 1970s and the 1980s and that became dominant in the 1990s. In public life and in the market, people largely follow the ideas strongly promoted during the last decade and a half and which provided the basis for Serb participation in the recent wars. It could be argued perhaps that both the democratic process and the market reform should be suspended for a while, to give time for building a new system of values. Does Serbia in these conditions have any chance of successfully completing the transition?

The problem does not lie in democracy, the market or what we call ‘open society’. The problem is that we do not have, and have never have had, any of this. What we have now is a seeming democracy and a poor imitation of a market economy inherited from Milošević’s period. People in Serbia believe that democracy is a political form in which those who rule are legitimised by the majority will expressed in elections, and that those who have won elections can do whatever they want - from infringements of human-rights values and disregard of constitutional norms to a pilfering economy and criminal wars. We are no longer at war, true, but all the above-mentioned forms of brutal despotism have remained under the mask of democracy. As in Milošević’s time, Serbia is a privatised state: the political institutions, the mechanisms of repression, the judicial system, the financial powers, the economic institutions and processes as well as - by no means least important - ‘the ideological apparatuses’ - remain under the control of a kind of a para-state cartel formed by the ruling parties, the parties of the ‘opposition’, the enormously wealthy ‘controversial businessmen’, the army, various police formations, the mafia, the Church and the court intellectuals. In sum, the basic facade of statehood inherited from the previous period has been retained, and the actors of the old regime have succeeded in preserving their network of interests practically untouched by forming an alliance with the part of the new elite gathered around Vojislav Koštunica and the Democratic Party of Serbia. Instead of a democratic transition as a process in which the institutions and the ideology of the old regime are dismantled and at the same time democratic institutions, rules and values are affirmed, we have got a perverted hybrid regime which keeps us tied to a bad past.

As to Serbia’s chances, I must say first that nothing is predestined so far as social and political relations are concerned, so that Serbia is not condemned to a gradual decomposition without an alternative. On the other hand, the comparative experience of the countries in transition suggests that there exist a certain sequence and rhythm of steps that must be made both in the dismantling of the old regime and the construction of a democratic order. If we look at the countries that have gone through the transition, we can see that some moments are most suitable for certain kinds of reform: first come constitutional changes that reform the political institutions, then democratic elections, after which so-called systemic laws are adopted of which probably the most important are those regulating the economic sphere. At the same time there is reconstruction of the state administration and the judicial system, subjection of the repressive apparatuses to democratic control, etc. But if you say that you are a society in transition, yet spend six years doing nothing but maintaining the key institutions and values of the old regime, then you are not standing in the same place but are in effect moving backwards, so that something that was possible and necessary to do at the very beginning becomes today almost impossible.

Nenad Dimitrijević teaches at the department of political studies of the Central European University in Budapest. His subject is constitutional and political theory, and he is the author of The Case of Yugoslavia: Socialism, Nationalism, Results (2001). This interview has been translated from Feral Tribune (Split), 30 June 2006.

ANYC said...

Looks like I have awaken the sleeping propaganda machine.

You say that 3000 serbs were killed since Kosova was liberated-why dont you prove it. That number is total of missing from the war. Not even your church (that makes a point of collecting that data) agrees to that number.
Your number of 1.5 million people comming back is absolutely ridiculos. However I have to give you credit that you finally admited that you expelled 1 million people.

And the Racak massacre, why don't you check my blog and see what the Finish team that did an independent autopsy said about that.
While you there also check the independent report from Germans with regard to who destroyed more cultural heritage Serbs in 3 months or Albanians in 7 years-you might be surpised when you see the answer.
Your arguments are not based on any reality as the world knows. You are brainwashed by your country's propaganda beyond help.

And finally one more point-you were the ones that sent the MUP an VJ to expell these people to begin with-please don't justify your initial barbarism with the consequences of it.

bogartwhite said...

As an American living in Kosovo, I have to say that it is very safe even for the Serbs I have met and talked to. The only violence that I have seen or even heard of is intra-ethnic not inter-ethnic. So it seems that much of this alarmist speech is politically motived and does not serve either community. Once again ordianry people are being manipulated by communist style politicians.

Fatos said...

It is very interesting how every serb knows a different number of Serb victims in Kosova. Starting from more radical in tens of thousands, to those more moderate in thousands, and then there are the down to earth ones who mention hundreds. THen you have some making them all babies (Ivan) and others admitting they were paramilitaries and death squad members.

I see that some of you are bothered by the Bill Clinton statue in the middle of Pristina - well he is our saviour - and we certainly understand why you dont raise something like that in the middle of Belgrade. It's not that you dont like kissing American ass, it's because "they bombed you" to quote ANYC because they thought you were savages (see def).

I dont know if it's because you are bad ass kissers, or what but i dont think this American ass kissing is being liked by Americans. Who knows why? I could only guess that they might still have some tapes of celebrations in Belgrade and other parts of Serbia when AL-Qaida hit New York. Talking about civilization - how come your people are in support of such a terrorist group? Or they might have heard that Serbia n government sent people to help Saddam defend Iraq from America? WOW

SOmeone asked me to change our national hat to some other one. Well my friend, back where I come from we practice ethnic and cultural tolerance - something we should preach you about. Your feeling of superiority (which I dont understand where it comes from) will leave you ruling Belgrade and the sorrounding villages in a few years.

ivan said...

" Your feeling of superiority (which I dont understand where it comes from) will leave you ruling Belgrade and the sorrounding villages in a few years. "

I am so glad that you finally admit of your siptar expansionistic policy.

Fatos said...

Your thinking is flawed. Nobody said that Albanians had any thoughts of conquering foreign land. All I said was that from a Serbia "from Belgrade to Tokyo" you will be left with almost nothing, if you continue practicing non-tolerance with non-serbs in Serbia.

ivan said...

Fatos,

" Nobody said that Albanians had any thoughts of conquering foreign land."

And what is Kosovo? ITs Serbian land, under all legal documents and laws it is serbian land. What are you doing to that land? Albanians have their own land, and that is Albania, but Kosovo is part of Serbia.

" All I said was that from a Serbia "from Belgrade to Tokyo" you will be left with almost nothing,"

how can we be left with almost nothing if we are not threatened by an outside force. Serbias biggest threat are albanians, because you are stealing Serbian land, first Kosovo and then you will insist on Preshevo and Medvedja because all together over there 80 thousand Albanians live.

Lets not forget to what is happening in Macedonia, or Northern Epiros in Greece.

bogartwhite said...

"stealing Serbian land"????

If we were to consult history (that is non-serbian history) the most virulent and violent expanionism in the balkans has come from the serbian state. For instance Vojvodina (over 100,000 germans murdered and expelled as well as hungarians), Kosova, the Morava valley (which had a sizable albanian and bosniak minority before the first balkan war) Bosnia (no explanation needed), Macedonia, Montenegro (which violently resisted incorporation into Yugoslavia), the Sanjak...the list goes on and on...

But serbs peasants have also suffered and continue to suffer from the (at this point ridiculous and absurd) 19th century serb nationalism.

Get with the program-ethnic wars are done-its over-nationalist serbia has been defeated... time to remake yourselves or face extinction as a state.

ivan said...

Bogatwrite,

please out of all the regions you listied has any one of them been an independent state that Serbia attacked?

All of those regions were at some point of time Serbian land until serbia got occupied by either the Ottomans or the Austrohungerians. And Bosnia was a civil war, and Serbia supported serbs from Bosnia, just the way your UCK terrorists used to be supported by albania( remember hiding in albania and conducting attack from albania, trying to provoke the Serbian police to fire back so you can claim that Serbia is trying to invade albania as well).

Just some questions to you smart siptars: Has Kosovo ever been a recognized state? And how long has Kosovo land been under the rule of Serbia ? And when you answer these questions ask yourself who is stealing whose land (please dont give me the BS of illyrians and Dardanians, cause with that theory all of southern US should belogn to Mexico)

Fatos said...

That Illyirian truth is what hurts you the most and invalidates your claims to Kosovo. All southern US would be part of Mexico, if Mexicans wanted :). They dont want that because they existence is not being threatenedlike Albanians' during your (Serb) agression. Americans dont ask Mexicans to dress a certain way, like you suggested Albanians should earlier. So my friend, history doesnt support your claims (your people moved to that reagion about 2700 years later than Illyrians - Albanians), the present doesnt support your claim (more than 90% ethinc Albanians live in Kosovo) and the future wont support your claim becuase it is flawed and needs to seize existing.

How did you support Serbs in Bosnia? By sending aircraft and tanks and thousands of soldiers? I wish Albania helped that way too, so we could stop your savagery.

I never said you were threatened by an outside force. It is EXACTLY minorities inside your country that you are not tolerating and are persecuting that will cause Serbia to become a tiny piece of land somehwere in the Balkans.

Thats what I am saying - from Belgrade to Tokyo dream is gone - the civilized world gave up its colonies in the 19-20th century. So by my calculation you are just about 100-200 behind us, the europeans.

ivan said...

Fatos,

again you go on saying the BS about illyrians and dardanians, which proves that you are stealing soverign countrys land. thanks

As for mexicans being able to to get southern usa but they dont want to, proves to me about you intellegence. This is also supported from you other comment on the other post, where you are confused.

Albanians being life threatened in Kosovo, well UCK terrorists were. How come nobody is able to tell me how many out of those 10 thousand albanian victims were woman, children and elderly? I am sure that more than 70% of them were man capable of fighting, and as i said Racak sais enough.

Let me remind you that it was the UCK terrorists who began the fighting. Let me also remind you that prior to 90s you enjoyed a very high autonomy, but then you wanted more...and why did Milosevic tell the Serbs " nobody is allowed to beat you!" Who was beating them in Kosovo? Oh yeah your famouse story of Martinovic the father of five children being gay, should explain that phenomenon ( ia m being sarcastic, i have to spell this out to you since i am afraid that you might get confused again).

As for the minorities, I find this example very strange, Sandzak was recruiting male population to fight in the Bosnian army against serbs, Sandzak business men were financially supporting the Bosnian army and yet Sandzak region was never sanctioned, or was there any suppression on the muslim population. that region became very rich during the wars, because they were the sole producers of textile for the Serbian market. And the way we treat minorities, our main political figure is Rasim Lajlic, a bosniak, and i am sure he is supported by a lot of serbs, because i myslef will most likely vote for him, and i am not the only serb with that stand.

At least in Serbia we dont need international force to protect our minorities lives and to give them some sort of freedom of movement.

" So by my calculation you are just about 100-200 behind us, the europeans. "

hahaha, thats the best joke i ever heard. Hey do you know that europe has electricity?

ANYC said...

"please out of all the regions you listied has any one of them been an independent state that Serbia attacked? "

Ha ha, this shows your true colors serb.
I guess since Kosova was not an independent state you had the right to deport and kill people living there. Nice one...
Slovenia, croatia and Bosnia were all indep when you attacked them or incited violence within serbs there.

As far as stealing land you got it all wrong serb.
Stealing is what you did to Rep Srpska where Bosnians were a majority-not anymore-as you know how you achieved that.
For Albanians, we had friends in high places so you could not do the same.
Deal with it...

ANYC said...

"I am sure that more than 70% of them were man capable of fighting, and as i said Racak sais enough."

Ivan, since you are to stupid to understand anything I will give this to you one more time-so hopefully you will shut you mouth with regard to Recak forever:

The Bloodbath in Racak was a Massacre
By our editor Petra de Koning HELSINKI, 10 March 2001


Finnish citizen Helena Ranta conducted the investigation of the massacre in Racak, Kosovo. For two years she did not want to talk about it. Now, she does. Quite a relief, she says, after "all the nonsense that has been said on this subject."
We looked at every centimeter of ground in the ditch, with small shovels, spoons, and metal detectors. It was the ditch in which the dead bodies of 23 Albanian men had lain, just outside the town of Racak in Kosovo. Finnish forensic experts crept through the mud, the bushes, the rocks. That was in November 1999, ten months after the massacre in Racak, in which a total of 45 Albanians were killed, including two women and a child.
"If we had found nothing in the ditch," the Finnish investigator Helena Ranta now says, "then it would have been entirely a set-up by the Albanians." But lying there were bullets, bullet shells, and even still a body part of one of the victims. That this was lying here was important, and how it was lying even more important.
Ranta sits in her office at the University of Helsinki. A small, sturdy woman with blond highlights in her hair and her glasses on a chain around her neck. She is a dentist, anthropologist, and molecular biologist. Ranta led the forensic investigation into the death of Albanians in Racak, commissioned by the European Union, and later also by the Yugoslavia tribunal in The Hague to do so.
The slaughter was not the first in Kosovo, but now indeed it is the best known. Western political leaders had already decided that the violence of Serbian soldiers against Albanians must finally come to an end. The television images out of Racak, of badly mutilated bodies in the ditch and in the village, horrified the West, and military intervention became even more urgent. Two months later, on March 24, 1999, the first NATO bombs fell on Yugoslavia.
There were already doubts about Racak at that time. French newspapers wrote that the Albanians had staged a massacre scenario in order to provoke NATO actions. Serb authorities had let it be known that in Racak "several dozens" of soldiers of the Albanian freedom forces UCK [KLA] were slain in the conflict. Other Albanians were supposed to have laid bodies in the ditch so that it would seem that they had been executed by Serbs.
The Finnish investigation team had examined the bodies in the hospital in Pristina, the capital city of Kosovo. In the village itself, they couldn't carry out an examination, because of the snow. At a press conference, shortly before the beginning of the air attack, Ranta presented no proof of a massacre, but hypotheses -- which everyone interpreted according to their own opinions and sympathies.
Thereafter Ranta said nothing more, for two years. About the research scarcely anything came out in the open. Doubts about Racak became stronger. Especially after the bombardments public opinion changed. Albanians drove Serbs out of Kosovo. They were no longer pitiable and had they really deserved the NATO actions? The Berliner Zeitung and the VPRO-program Argos (Dutch TV) opined that on the basis of autopsy reports by the Finns that the victims of Racak hadn't been shot from up close. That would mean that the Serbian version made sense, that the Albanians had been killed in battle. The BBC reported last year in a retrospective look at the Kosovo war that the UCK in Racak had "provoked" the Serbs. Last month the German WDR transmitted a documentary with the title "It began with a lie. The Racak lie."
Indeed it was too bad, says Ranta, that she couldn't react to "all the nonsense" that was said and written on this matter. She was afraid that she would harm a possible lawsuit against Milosevic adjudicated by the Yugoslavian tribunal if she reported about her investigation. Racak is an important part of the accusation against the Yugoslavian ex-president, and Ranta herself will appear as a witness in a possible trial
Last month the EU found that indeed something about the forensic investigation needed to be made public. Colleagues of Ranta had, without her knowing about it, written a scientific article about the investigation of the dead bodies. The Berliner Zeitung had seen the piece prior to publication and had ascertained that there still was no evidence of a massacre. The EU decided that a summary of the investigation report should be available to anyone who requested it. But the summary is vaguely worded and barely understandable. A Russian diplomat at the UN Security Council was furious. Now still no one knew who was responsible for the slaughter.
Ranta smiled; she had kept the summary vague intentionally. Now she is willing to talk about it, to explain what was meant by the summary. No one should think that she had gathered no evidence -- but as for drawing conclusions, that will be left up to the judges of the tribunal. It was her duty, she says, to rule out scenarios. Of the Serbian scenario, nothing remained. "We have found no indication that it did not have to do with unarmed citizens." On the morning of the massacre there was fighting in the area, nine UCK fighters were killed, but they did not belong to the 45 whose bodies were found the following day. "In the pockets of the dead, we encountered no munitions, but only banknotes." The dead were wearing citizens' clothing, seven or eight layers over one another, it was winter. In these clothes they were killed, according to the forensic investigation.
It can also be ruled out that the 23 men in the ditch were somehow killed in some other manner. They were not laid in there later, there was nothing "staged." Ten months after the massacre, the Finnish investigators found bullets in the ditch. They lay under the ground, at the places where the bodies were found. Next to one of the bullets lay also a body part. Results of the autopsy in the Pristina hospital were compared with what was found in the trench: the man whose body part had been found was lying on the ground when he was shot dead. About the other victims there was, according to Ranta, a similar pattern observable.
From the investigation it appeared that the Albanians in the ditch couldn't have been shot from a long distance. If that had indeed been the case, then the bullets couldn't have been lying in the ditch itself. Moreover bullet shells were found in the bushes next to the ditch. So it can be calculated from what distance the shooting took place. Ranta is not willing to name the exact distance. "What difference does it make if it was one or two meters? It was not in battle."
The investigators have also ascertained that the bullets that were found in the bodies and in the ditch came from a "small number" of weapons. How many exactly is something Ranta will not say. In the autopsy, described in the scientific article by her colleagues, it seems that eleven bodies exhibited signs of a "series of shots."
Immediately after the massacre the tribunal established an ad-hoc office in Macedonia and queried witnesses. With the examination of the bodies and the research in the ditch the Racak affair is the "best investigated matter in the history of the tribunal," Ranta thinks. "I think that we are probably very close to the truth."



Do you see how much brainwashed you are Ivan?

Fatos said...

Ivan, it is funny to see how you consider yourself intelligent in commenting on my post- when you actually didnt even understand what I said. I feel you are too rushed to post a response, and the quality of your answers shows that.

Albania never fought with Serbia for a free Kosova. Albanians in KOSOVA did. When I mentioned Mexicans it was clear (but to you) that I was talking about Mexicans in the US. If you think that Mexicans like a life under the Mexican govt better than you have got to do a lot of catching up. I know, being behind for 200 years is a lot, but hey we were all there.

Im sure Europe has electricity, mostly because they didnt have to deal with animals like we did, who destroyed everything that was ours - in case you dont understand I am talking about Serbs here. Even when they dealt with Germany, they made them pay reparations, which btw is something your country can learn from.

Your posts are lacking reasoning. Try not attacking people personally and give us some reason to believe your view - who knows in the mean time, when you are thinking of reasons, you might realize that you r view is wrong.

NYoutlawyer said...

You lying mother fucking albaniac pricks. A Serb walking through pisstina is like an Israeli walking into a hezbollah mosque. How many of you shiptar muzzies are going to Lebanon to help your brothers kill Israelis?

mitrovica pika pika said...

NYouthouselawyer you seem so frustrated. Did some albanian refuse to fuck your obese ass? Mabe he just wasnt gay.

mitrovica pika pika said...

Ivana said:
"I am sure that more than 70% of them were man capable of fighting, and as i said Racak sais enough."

People in srebrenica also were of fighting age, however, their hands were tied behind their backs, they were unarmed and they were shot behind their backs. the international law is clear, if someone is summarily executed its a violaion and as such you shall be held liable in international court or nato shall bomb your ass to prevent you from doing the same in another place-see Kosova.So to sum up just because someone is of fighting age it doesnt mean you can shoot them behind their backs while they are tied up.

bogartwhite said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
bogartwhite said...

The hate speech about all Albanians 1) being Muslims and 2) being fundamentalists is so, soo, sooo tired. As the international community has had a presence in Kosova now for over 7 years, they have come to respect Kosovar Albanian society as not only secular, but extremely hospitable and tolerant. The only claim that Serb society can make that tops Kosova, is that Serb women are veeeeery hospitable whereas Albanian society is a bit more sexually restrained. Although I think this is less true in pristina.

However sex for political favoritism will carry nationalist Serbia only so far. And at this point I think the international community is a little tired of Svetlana as well.

ivan said...

ANYC,

Very interesting article, however I find it very strange that she conducted the field work ten months after the incident and then all of a suddent she decided to speak about it two years after the incident. And from another source, her initial report stated that there was no massacre and that all of the victims had gun powder on their hands. Now we get the excuse that they didn’t have ammunition in their pockets. Well ofcourse not, if the UCK terrorists changed their clothes, they would have made sure that no signs of weapons would be found on the bodies. However I still find it very amusing that she forgot to mention that all of the victims had same military boots.

Fatos,


“Albania never fought with Serbia for a free Kosova. Albanians in KOSOVA did”

Same thing with Serbia and Bosnia, it was Serbs in Bosnia who were fighting the war, we just supported them, the same way you were supported by the recruitments from Albania in the UCK terrorist rows.

“If you think that Mexicans like a life under the Mexican govt better than you have got to do a lot of catching up.”

I am glad you mentioned this, because your above sentence explains why Albanians immigrate to any country the first chance they get. Kosovo after the second world war was an example of mass Albanian immigration. Western Europe I don’t even need to mention. Greece 10 years ago did not have more than 100 albanians in Athens. Now there are more than 400,000. Why do your people immigrate? Is it because you love your government?
“Im sure Europe has electricity, mostly because they didnt have to deal with animals like we did, who destroyed everything that was ours”

What was yours ? hahaha. Let me just remind you that unemployment was always extremely high in Kosovo, and I remember all the programs in Serbia of helping Kosovo. Each Serb had to give up one salary for the benefit of Kosovo. So those plants were not build by the Albanian tax payers money, but the Serbian sacrifice in order to help you. Also let me remind you that these plants were taken care of by Serbs for the last 10 years since you boycotted to work. So please use your logic, if I build it with my money, and then I took care of that , how does that make it yours. And besides you had more than 2 bilion euros invested into you, and I wonder where did this money go?

“Your posts are lacking reasoning”

Please spare me the BS. IF you have problems reading and comprehending, don’t blame it on serbs again.

Bogartwhite,

It seems to me that you didn’t get laid for a long time.

“As the international community has had a presence in Kosova now for over 7 years, they have come to respect Kosovar Albanian society as not only secular, but extremely hospitable and tolerant”

Here is an addition to your above comment….. “ they proved this in March 2004 where they wanted to show their secularism by destroying every single possible church that was on their way. Their hospitality is beyond words, they have a tradition to greet people of different ethnic origin by throwing stones at their vehicles when they pass by. IF they have ammunition , they will use it instead of stones, and they are very sensitive on children as well. When they see children of different ethnicality, they get so happy that they take a rifle and shoot at these children. But this is an Albanian way of saying “ welcome” “

mitrovica pika pika said...

Ivana, you are such a smart little bitch.
you proved me and everyone here wrong on every issue concerning Kosova. I dont want independece for Kosova now, I want greater Albania. If serbs got away with genocide and were awarded half of Bosnia why shouldnt albanians from Macedonia, serbia and Montenegro join Albania.

ANYC said...

Very interesting article, however I find it very strange that she conducted the field work ten months after the incident and then all of a suddent she decided to speak about it two years after the incident.

Ivan-did your moma drop you in your head when you were a little baby....

Since you seem to have memory problems this is a cronology of the events the way they happened:

1.The massacre took place.
2. OSCE at that time verified it as a massacre. Serbs denied it.(note not the Americans-OSCE)
3. Then serbs after scleaning up the crime scene (remember the VJ was still there) asked for an independent team to come in and investigate-which was the Finish team.
4. Their report was published saying that they were civilians not in the battle, exactly as she says in her interview.

Man is there anything in the world that you guys have not attached a conspiracy theory. The "original" report you are talking about was spun by Milo for people like you, who will trust their govt blindly.

Give it up already, your whole life you have been lied to, and it shows-to the point of denying even most common sense things.

bogartwhite said...

Ivan...

In the March riots more albanians where killed then serbs...

UNMIK was the primary target not the serbs...

Serb women are easy, albanian women are not...which is why serb forces had to rape 20,000 albanian women and girls...as they did in bosnia and croatia. I think it is serb men who are not getting laid since their women are busy sleeping with the entire world.

but seriously, kosovoa will be an independednt country and ally of the US. Serbia will have an ultra-nationalist government and be isolated even further. Albanian influence will increase and serbia will remain a black-hole filled with socio-paths and whores.